Trainer Sprite Revamp and Creation 2.0

[Reliability]

Post revamps and new trainer sprites here from now on, so that we can keep them all in one place.

[ImmunityBow]

EDIT: IB made a silly! Removed to avoid confusion.

[Blade Flight]

Uhh, IB, Iglona isn't a Trainer spirte...XD

[ImmunityBow]

Eh, whoops.

[Reliability]

Yeah so, I did something finally.
http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/3550/alisasprite.png
I decided to ditch the hat. In the long run, it was just to difficult to sprite and she looks better without it.

EDIT: Also,
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/8784/simonsprite.png

[ImmunityBow]

Ooh, I like Simon! He's just the right amount of cool and too big for his shoes. Just two things: the belt looks a bit jagged, could you use the darker shade of the jacket as a bit of anti-aliasing to make it smoother? Also, the lighter patch on the coat seems like it's the wrong shape somehow. It doesn't quite seem to end where the shadow of the upper part would fall.

Alisa has a few things going on that I'm not a fan of at the moment. I think her colour scheme is fine and that a lot of things are placed correctly (the anatomy is correct, which is difficult to achieve). I like how she's not overly feminine, like most of the girls in Pokemon. However, there's lots of little quality things that prevent her from getting there, as well as two design concepts, so let me start with those:
1. Don't you think she looks a little too cute for how she acts in game? Her face reminds me of Kirby.
2. I'm not in love with her pose. What's she trying to do? Is her left arm bending backwards? Overall it's stiff and doesn't have the cool factor that comes with Alisa's dialogue.
I'm also going to list some of the issues I see by looking at her:
- I don't understand the flow to her hair. The part on top of her head is for the most part fine but behind her back it seems rather spiky and it doesn't quite hang down.
- There is a straight line cutting around her waist which should somehow be curved. I think the best was to do this is to lower the right (our left) section a little since her vest seems cut off and not her pants.
- The lining on her shirt is quite jagged and doesn't look quite right.
- A line cuts off her boots too, which isn't so bad but might look better if fixed.
- He right pant (our left) has outlining issues that would be hard to see on a transparent background but on the blue of the forums it seems like the outline vanishes at some points and is a bit jagged.
- The shading on her pants could be smoother.
- It's unclear on her left sleeve what is folding and where the shading is.

I know this is a lot of criticism and if you want me to help with the edit for a few of the harder to explain things or just because spriting her is frustrating or something, I will. I tried my best to keep the tone respectful but there really are a lot of things to work on.

Thank you for your work, Reliability, with these being necessary for the demo I'm glad we're moving along.

[Reliability]

I think I may redo Alisa entirely. Compared with Simon, I don' think I did a very good job on her. She's a bit too heavily mixed anyway.

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/5043/bradleysprite.png
To add.

[Sev]

One problem with whoever that is in last post. The hair looks like you resized it in MSPaint.

[Reliability]

Bradley was never resized. The hair that I used was blocky to begin with and adding the highlights probably made the problem worse. I'll see what I can do, but I can't think of many options to try and fix it.

And I heard Alisa needed cool factor.
http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/3550/alisasprite.png

[ImmunityBow]

Good job on taking away most of Bradley's youngster-ness. I think he's pretty decent. The bag looks a little incongruous with the rest of the sprite though, since it looks so realistic and the rest of the sprite is stylized.

This Alisa is far better, with the most glaring problem being that her neck is overextended, her vest is still off (though I don't think you made changes to that), and that it's hard to tell that the forward elbow is bent. Also I remember that a few members here were complaining about crow feet. You totally rectified the first design concept I was talking about, and the second is a strong improvement.

Awesome progress!

[NyteFyre]

As far as I can see, Alisa looks much better. Only real problems I can see have already been said by IB. Though, the way both feet are pointed inward seems a bit strange to me. Unless those are the 'Crow's Feet' IB mentioned. IDK. Maybe having both face the same direction, or having one face directly forward would rectify this?

[ImmunityBow]

Yes, crow feet was the term used when the complaints were made, but it refers to both feet facing inward, which Nintendo tends to like to do for some reason.

[Reliability]

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/5043/bradleysprite.png
Removed highlights and tries to get rid of the blockiness of the hair. I made the bag smaller, skewed it to the left and changed the shading on it.

http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/3550/alisasprite.png
Moved her head to the right and down. Made her wider through the body to give the vest more definition. Turned the feet outward. Extended the arm.

[MeekRhino]

I really like the change to the feet, they look much better. All around, both sprites look very nice. My only complaint is that something feels strange about Alisa's pose. I can't put my finger on it right now, but I will try to get back to you on that.

[NyteFyre]

Looks great to me, other than her right, our left, leg's outline seems a bit wonky. It dips inward, it seems, right about where the knee should be.

As for Bradley, everything looks incredible. However, any thoughts on changing the bag's color? The brown coloring is a bit bland, and hard to make out definitively at this size and angle. To some, it could possible be seen as a blob, no offense intended.

[ImmunityBow]

Experimenting with Bradley's bag's colours might be a good idea.

Could you possibly move Alisa's head down one pixel to shorten the neck? It's set on right now but it's still very long.

[Reliability]

http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/8274/bradleybags.png
http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/3550/alisasprite.png

[Cyndadile]

I like Bradley #2 (blue bag), and Alisa looks great.

[ImmunityBow]

#2 looks good, #5 is fine as well. Great job!

[NyteFyre]

Number 2 is a nice contrast with Bradley's overall color scheme, which may help in the long run of establishing his role with the Professor; however, I do really enjoy number 5, though this is on a more instinctual level, over a rational level. I just really like it.

[MeekRhino]

I love the second one, the contrast looks very cool.

[Reliability]

It looks like we're going with the second one. Let us all thank Engil for the palette.
(Before anyone asks, the others were Coroona, Seraph and Blitzfaust)

[Cyndadile]

I suppose that in a way, that's kind of fitting.

[Blade Flight]

I can't see the Alisa sprite...wonder why that is?

[ImmunityBow]

I couldn't see it at first, which is why I didn't comment on it. I see it now, and the neck looks much better.

[Reliability]

I can't see the Alisa sprite...wonder why that is?
It seems to appear and disappear occasionally. It was up when I first posted it, but it did go away. I see it again now, too.

[NyteFyre]

Hmm, Alisa's sprite has yet to disappear on me, strange.

[Quinn]

Bradleys is the 2nd one? Lol, cause honestly I like the 3rd best (as usual, I am the one who differs) maybe do the 2nd colors on the 3rd design? I just like 3's scheme feel going down.

[ImmunityBow]

#3 hurts my eyes though, and doesn't really solve the problem that it's hard to distinguish the sides of the bag in the original.

[Reliability]

Because I need to have them finished for the script, I decided that enough was enough and that we need to at least have some semblance of what the Ghost-type E4 is going to be. So here, I produced one, Myrna.
http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/246/myrnay.png

How does this feel to you all? Yay? Nay? Neigh?

[NyteFyre]

Umm....maybe it's just me, but her arms aren't very well defined, so it's hard to tell if she has 2 arms on one side, or if one is just behind her, and what's with the scarf like thing?

[Cyndadile]

and what's with the scarf like thing?

I believe it's a scarf. :D
But it can be hard to tell on smaller sprites.

I like it... except for the colors. I think the scarf is fine, but a black or gray dress might look more... ghostly.

[NyteFyre]

It reminds me a bit of one of the Kimono Girls, personally. She needs more personality, and maybe a different color between the scarf and top. As I said, the arms aren't well defined.

[Reliability]

I had a lot of trouble with the arms, since they aren't actually scratched... I really just wanted to get something done, so I took that liberty. But I don't really understand what you mean by the colours. She has on a dress and a scarf, and they are already different colours (clearly). And in terms of personality, what would you want to see? I don't really get what you mean there I either.

In terms of swapping the red for black or grey, I was just worried about creating a design too similar to Layla, who will likely be in black and possibly grey. I was trying to create some variety.

[Cyndadile]

But red isn;t really associated with ghost in pokemon games. Do we have Layla yet?

A purple might work too.

[Reliability]

I guess I was going for sort of a bloody look. I used a Ferrain palette, but it might pervade a stronger direction if it were darker?

I made a Layla a long time ago, but it was just a concept. But she's going to be really dark, no matter how she turns out.

[NyteFyre]

Oh, I see it now. I couldn't tell the positioning off her body, so it looked like one arm was in a white sleeve, and the other arm was coming from behind her head...

[ImmunityBow]

The domain is blocked for me D: I guess Singapore really doesn't trust imageshack.

[Reliability]

Reposted for those in Singapore.
http://www.pokemontopaz.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=741

[ImmunityBow]

She is incredibly short and overall quite small and young looking. Is that intentional? I like her concept, but it looks like her legs are quite a bit too short for her body, though it's hard to tell. She looks very whimsical, which is something we've been missing a lot of in Topaz trainers, so awesome job on that. The shading on the dress is a little bit too sectioned out, and the feet might work out better if they were either all hidden or showing more. I like all the detail you've put in and I like her as a Ghost E4.

[Reliability]

Yes, she is a child. I don't think there has been an E4 member in any canon game that young, so I figured it would be something new. As long as we're good with the concept, I can leave it for now. Just writing her is difficult if I don't know who she is.

I imagined Greyson being the token older trainer, is that fine? I'm probably not going to sprite him out first, but that's what I envisioned him as.

[Cyndadile]

That sounds reasonable for Greyson.

[NyteFyre]

Mhmm. However, may I suggest something? I think he should have some sort of strange quirk. Something that really makes him stand out. Like...He dresses like a woman? He is older than dirt? He has a gaming addiction? He's actually dead? He's a perv? There's any number of ideas.

[Cyndadile]

I thought he was the NORMAL E4 member...

[NyteFyre]

If he is, that'd just make it all the more hilarious. He'd be a paradox. He's an eccentric Normal Type Master.

[Cyndadile]

Well then, Greyson would probably have to have a role outside the E4, like in a side quest, that makes his quirk more prominent. There's not a whole lot that we can get across in a short E4 pre-battle speech.

[NyteFyre]

Well, it could be expressed in his sprite? Or perhaps you randomly meet him somewhere outside the E4. He has a random blurb, or scene?

[Reliability]

Greyson is STEEL type though.

I wouldn't mind having a transvestite character, but I'm not sure Greyson is the way to go. These aren't supposed to be super developed characters. As Cyn said, this is a shot period of time to have a really full personality to express. If he has a quirk, it has to be easy to get across in two lines and one image. Also keep in mind that someone is going to have to sprite this, so try to keep in mind that certain things may not be easy to do as far as images go, not matter how solid the idea. Like, if we wanted Greyson to be an android, I'm not positive that is spriteable.

[NyteFyre]

Fair pont, though like I said, in the newer games, many of the "underdeveloped" characters got a little more development outside of their original meeting. Also, there are always random NPCs that generally have something to say about such people, even if it's subtle, or not a whole lot.

I can see your point on the spriting, but not all of them are that hard.

[ImmunityBow]

A lot of our gym leaders are actually getting that kind of development. Say, Tristan, Christina, and I'm pretty sure a fair few are involved with something you have to do before you can face them. E4 leaders, on the other hand, rarely get that kind of treatment. Steven and Lance do, but there's also a large representation of leaders that don't.

[Reliability]

And our Champion is well rep'd in the storyline, just like Lance, Steven, and Alder.

[NyteFyre]

Not to Mention Wallace, and Blue. :3

Oh, and Cynthia too, she appears EVERYWHERE *.*

[Will]

I've done a backsprite for the male hero (just a re-color):

[Cyndadile]

We try to avoid using recolors, especially for something this important. 50% of players will see this sprite every time they enter a battle, so it needs to be original.
(Actually, more than 50%. It's highly unlikely that we'll attract as many female players as male players. However, I'm sure my stunning good looks will encourage female players to get our game ;D)

[Will]

I take your point on board. Changed the hair, but I can't see how to change the bag, although I know it needs changing. Some shading issues as well.

I'm very happy for someone to take over on this one, as I just can't seem to get it right.

[Cyndadile]

The hair does look nice, although the hat and bag are still more familiar. If you want to try scratching the bag, I'd suggest looking at backpack-selling sites online, finding one you like, and trying to model the sprite after it.

[Will]

Okay changed the bag ... not sure about it though.

[Cyndadile]

The designs on the bag seem to be level, as if you were looking straight at it. Based on the angle of the sprite, the bag design would be rotated clockwise a little. It would also need some way to show depth. Maybe darker shading on the left side?
Other than that, I can't really say much. My spritecrafting experience is very limited.