Pokemon Black and White (5th generation) discussion

[SilentSentinel]

Smogon has 5th gen analyses working in process. They don't have like a full thing like they do for all the old gens though. They are too focused on what to start their tiers at, and are not concentrating on getting a good database for 5th gen knowledge, which I think will hurt them in the end. Not to mention that their battle simulator (pokelab) sucks compared to Pokemon Online. PO is really the best out there by far.

[Merlin]

yeah i've heard about the smogon stuff, haven't been there yet, as to the 3rd pokemon game i'm thinking there is going to be one....
i don't think they'll be able to get away with only two in this set, unless this game set was supposed to be a remake of an earlier game which is seriously, highly unlikely....
yes i did notice the dual legendary trio but it's not as astonishing as the D/P/P set was when they released info for like 10 or so legends in one generation...
3rd gen had 2 legendary trios but the fact that they finally made a Fire/Dragon, Electric/Dragon and Ice/Dragon trio is incredible, especially since they're the primary legednaries unlike the legendary birds from 1st gen and the legendary dogs from 2nd Gen...
has anyone been able to learn why B/W is called B/W yet?
i know there've been some rumors going around about them being connected to 1st gen but i'm pretty certain they arent all evidence considered and all...

[NyteFyre]

Probably because Zekrom and Rashiram are mostly black and white, and there is are places found only in one specific game. White Forest and Black City, or whatever it's called. That's why I believe they're called Black and White. Also, there was something about getting back to the roots of pokemon or something.

[Tyrannigon64]

A quote from Junichi Masuda from an interview for Nintendo Power, found on pg 18 of the March 2011 issue:

"We choose the titles to express the themes of each game. Like, diamonds are the hardest substance in the world, so that fit the theme of "ultimateness" in Pokemon Diamond and Pearl. This time we're pursuing a theme of "polarity," things that are defined by their opposition to each other. Take, for example, angles and demons, or light and shadow-if one didn't exist, the other would lose all meaning. "White" is a blank slate with potential to become anything, while "black" is complete and unchanging. So our intention actually wasn't to return to the basics, but to evoke that particular theme."

Does that answer your question?

[SilentSentinel]

Hmm, that's interesting. For the longest time I always thought that the idea behind it was focused on the fact that they returned to basic colors, the first time since Gen I (It's been precious metals ever since the original RBY days, Black and White return to this). There are certainly some things that bring the series back to basics though, like the fact that no returning pokemon are found pre-national dex.

[zeroality]

There are certainly some things that bring the series back to basics though, like the fact that no returning pokemon are found pre-national dex.

A bit unrelated but VGC 2011 also bans all pre-5th gen Pokemon.

IPL told me his team and barring hax, I think he has a great chance to win it all. He's using stuff that will make people rage hard. I hope he does win so it forces Gamefreak to rethink certain things when it comes to stuff in competitive Pokemon.

[ImmunityBow]

I don't think Gamefreak really cares about competitive Pokemon.

It's just ridiculous to balance a game with nearly 600 different basic elements, not to mention the variants of all of them. It's not really worth their time or money. Advanced gen was where it was manageable, and it's way beyond that now. All they can hope to do is introduce a new competitive environment (which it seems they have done well, even though everything looks so broken) and let the players sort it out with ban lists and metagame.

[XTS]

Truthfully, I could absolutely picture someone going up to a pokemon creator and asking "do you realize how broken the 5th Gen metagame is on the battle sims," and have the creator reply, "there are battle sims?"

...I might EV/IV train some legendaries just for the sake of it, in case by some fluke I'm able to get to the nearest qualifying thingy for the VGC.

[ImmunityBow]

From what I understand NoA is aware of Smogon, but doesn't really care.

[SilentSentinel]

If they cared about competitive battling, they probably wouldn't have made the metagame so blisteringly fast paced. Besides like... Ferrothorn and Jellicent there aren't many truely defensive pokemon. The evolution stone remedies this to an extent, but those pokemon suffer greatly without lefties.

In 4th gen, there was no way to counter everything, but at least you could cope with most things. Now, there's always at least 3 or 4 pokemon that will completely ruin you. It's just impossible to have a way to beat everything with only 6 pokemon. Plus, conventional boosting takes a major hit with Ditto running around.

Some of the pokemon on the current UU list astound me. Azelf? the Deoxys forms? Terakion?

That's why I've been focusing on improving my play in Ubers recently. OU is basically a total crapshoot, while Ubers is pretty similar to 4th gen.

[zeroality]

Yeah, the problem with OU is that banlists are still being formulated. Same for UU.

Suspect testing, discussion, and ultimately voting. It's a pain, but we're working on a new voting system/formula at PO that should improve things.

(IE: Shadow Tag Shandera/Chandelure won't be voted Dream World OU again, I can pretty much guarantee you that)

I know NoA was aware of NetBattle. I can't imagine that they'd be ignorant of Pokemon Online either, considering that the combined servers tend to have over 1,000 players during peak hours.

Our PO server frequently caps out at the ~500 player limit. coyotte is still working on a way to raise the limit, something to do with a socket issue.

Smogon is also working on banlists (separately from PO... I know - it's not ideal but what can we do?) and they have recently banned Drizzle + Swift Swim. You can use one or the other but not both in conjunction.

[SilentSentinel]

Well, it's now upon us. I picked up Black this morning. The game is beautiful, but I'm a bit miffed that the Toggle Running feature from HG/SS was removed.

[Cyndadile]

Pokemon White!

What is th C-gear/global link supposed to be for?

[PokePoindexter]

If I can choose between which game I get (if I get either), I'd probably pick White, just because I can get Reuniclus in that game (my favorite BW Poke, and not just because of his OU potential).

[Cyndadile]

So, I'm in pinwheel forest right now, and I'm up against a Throh and a Timburr. They just killed my Blitzle and Roggenrola in the same turn. I tried switching my Lillipup in, and then my Oshawott. I proceeded to spend 15 minutes trying to figure out why it wouldn't let me choose my 2nd pokemon before coming here to rant. While I was typing this (I'm a slow typer and am distracted easily), I realized that I needed to choose Blitz or Roggen (to tell it which to replace with Lillipup), instead of choosing my 2nd pokemon. I feel somewhat inadequate.

[XTS]

The same thing happened to me against a couple of wilds outside the Giant Chasm...I dunno if it took me 15 minutes, but I did my fair share of raging over it.

But yeah, Black is incredible. Great graphics, of course great pokemon, and the sort of plot you'd expect from a top-notch fangame - the people are actually that, people, not just characters filling a role, but which get out and try to make a difference, have their own opinions, etc. On both small scale and large scale, it's a huge improvement over 4th Gen (and, though it begrudges me to admit it, 3rd Gen), and I can't wait to buy White, too, so I can start playing through it all over again.

[Cyndadile]

My only problem is that, so far, there has been ONE thing to use an HM on. And, there is a doctor/nurse at the start of almost every route. But other than that, its great. One of my friends, though, was ranting because he finished it on monday.

I'm quite impressed with the battle graphics; the movement of the sprites and the panning/zooming of the camera seems very smooth.

I'm at the city after route 4 right now.

[zeroality]

Pokemon White!

What is th C-gear/global link supposed to be for?

Dunno if this is the same thing but someone wrote a guide to the Entralink on PO Forums. I would simply quote but it's relatively long so linking instead.

[Cyndadile]

Thanks, that helps too.

[Reliability]

I've finished the game once and immediately started over. Also, my Pokemon caught Pokerus today.

[Cyndadile]

Also, my Pokemon caught Pokerus today.

If I remember correctly, that's good for stats? If so, try to spread it.

[Reliability]

Already boxed a Pokemon that caught it. I don't know if you can reinfect after they've healed, but that's all I can really do.

Yes, it's like Macho Brace but without the nerf to speed and taking up the item slot.

[XTS]

I've caught PokeRus in a couple different Emerald runs, plus a SoulSilver run, plus most stuff I got off the Gen IV GTS was given PokeRus, so once I transfer a couple of those still infected from my box to Black, I'll be able to infect everything else at will....that might help when I start doing runs through White, I can give PokeRus to the early-game team; a lot of stuff early on gives out either Attack or Speed EVs....

[zeroality]

Isn't Pokerus rarer than finding a shiny?

[Reliability]

It's comparable rarity.

[BladeVap]

It IS rarer, but still not the rarest thing in Pokemon...I believe that would be the Mirage Island in RSE...

[SilentSentinel]

Huh, I've seen Mirage Island three seperate times. Only ever got pokerus once on Crystal though.

[XTS]

Run into five shinies, I believe (only 2 of which I managed to catch and hold onto), but never seen Mirage Island - though to be fair, I didn't really check that often, so whatever.

[PokePoindexter]

Only time any of my Pokemon have had PKRS was in my...eighth or ninth playthrough of Pokemon Emerald. And after I'd already EV trained the Pokemon I was going to use on my team.

I think I'll wait on buying either Black or White until I finish this school year - only a month left. Maybe Marriland will have completed his Video series of it by that time too.

[NyteFyre]

I think the event like thing with the least chance of happening is if you win one of the in game lottery, completely, and get a free Masterball.